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A joint assignment is a great opportunity, but if you do not get promoted to lieutenant colonel or selected for battalion command, it will not take you very far. Leads by Example . We should not expend all of our energy on the top 10 percent while the remaining 90 percent are the men and women operating the organization. Other than collective assumptions about desirable characteristics in a commander, we dont know for sure which have a causal relationship with mission success or to what degree. If detailed data is not submitted, units leave the decision to assignment officers who may not have complete information to assign the officer who is best suited to the unit's mission. Many of my peers find themselves questioning if their efforts over the last 1618 years still mean anything. However, officers must understand that not all advice is relevant. .c_dVyWK3BXRxSN3ULLJ_t{border-radius:4px 4px 0 0;height:34px;left:0;position:absolute;right:0;top:0}._1OQL3FCA9BfgI57ghHHgV3{-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-pack:start;justify-content:flex-start;margin-top:32px}._1OQL3FCA9BfgI57ghHHgV3 ._33jgwegeMTJ-FJaaHMeOjV{border-radius:9001px;height:32px;width:32px}._1OQL3FCA9BfgI57ghHHgV3 ._1wQQNkVR4qNpQCzA19X4B6{height:16px;margin-left:8px;width:200px}._39IvqNe6cqNVXcMFxFWFxx{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;margin:12px 0}._39IvqNe6cqNVXcMFxFWFxx ._29TSdL_ZMpyzfQ_bfdcBSc{-ms-flex:1;flex:1}._39IvqNe6cqNVXcMFxFWFxx .JEV9fXVlt_7DgH-zLepBH{height:18px;width:50px}._39IvqNe6cqNVXcMFxFWFxx ._3YCOmnWpGeRBW_Psd5WMPR{height:12px;margin-top:4px;width:60px}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN{height:18px;margin-bottom:4px}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN._2E9u5XvlGwlpnzki78vasG{width:230px}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN.fDElwzn43eJToKzSCkejE{width:100%}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN._2kNB7LAYYqYdyS85f8pqfi{width:250px}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN._1XmngqAPKZO_1lDBwcQrR7{width:120px}._3XbVvl-zJDbcDeEdSgxV4_{border-radius:4px;height:32px;margin-top:16px;width:100%}._2hgXdc8jVQaXYAXvnqEyED{animation:_3XkHjK4wMgxtjzC1TvoXrb 1.5s ease infinite;background:linear-gradient(90deg,var(--newCommunityTheme-field),var(--newCommunityTheme-inactive),var(--newCommunityTheme-field));background-size:200%}._1KWSZXqSM_BLhBzkPyJFGR{background-color:var(--newCommunityTheme-widgetColors-sidebarWidgetBackgroundColor);border-radius:4px;padding:12px;position:relative;width:auto} An evaluation philosophy articulates the link between a senior raters leader development strategy and the evaluation as recorded output. DA Form 67-10 series OERs have been modified to now reflect the removal of MSAF data entry requirements. (See figure 1.) Take the time to define your evaluation philosophy, counsel your subordinates on what it means, and continue to follow-up with the rated individual. Often officers place a high priority on joint assignments; however, there are risks associated with receiving jobs for which only "the best" are assigned. Unequivocally, all fiscal year 2017 lieutenant colonel selectees had at least one "most qualified" officer evaluation report (OER) during their key developmental (KD) positions. 0 For instance, if the officer is very fit, you can state, "Captain Doe achieved a score of 345 on his latest PT test," instead of saying, "Captain Doe is in good shape." Officers normally serve 36 months in an assignment, and the YMAV or DEROS is usually in the last month. The way officers perform far outweighs their assigned positions. Covey's third principle, which he calls "put first things first," helps leaders to discern urgency from importance. For more details visit, 04-PUB NOT RELEASABLE TO FOREIGNERS (NOFORN), A APPROVED FOR PUBLIC RELEASE; DISTRIBUTION IS UNLIMITED, ADRP - Army Doctrine References Publications, ATTP - Army Tactics, Techniques, and Procedures, FY Publication Status Report (CAC required for access), Publishing Resources (CAC required for access), PC/PCO/FMO/EPCO Directory (CAC required for access), usarmy.pentagon.hqda-apd.mbx.customer-service@army.mil, Search Army publications and forms by Number, Title, or Record Detail. Networking at the field-grade level is integral to continuing career progression. If your officers don't know the expectations, you can't effectively rate them. 02/1/1992. Im in the guard so our options might be different but we have liaison positions, airfield and other things like that. First, it describes how a rater or senior rater sees evaluations. I caution you to avoid confusing military education/qualifications with future broadening assignments. For Senior Rater an MQ is a major discriminator and separates officers. He later completed the Special Forces Qualification Course, earning the Green Beret and served in 1st Special Forces Group (Airborne) and 1stSpecial Forces Command (Airborne). For example, you will be asked whether the officer "possesses desire, will, initiative, and discipline," and you will only be given a choice between yes or no. Army Regulation 614-100, Officer Assignment Policies, Details, and Transfers, offers detailed insight on assignment policies. Assignment officers are concerned with the "faces" aspect, which is based on their routine communication with the population completing the process. The Army should have results of such testing for every single potential battalion commander, given the impacts such leaders will have within their respective units. Officers may have promotion to lieutenant colonel basically locked, but the probability of being selected for battalion command may be lower. The Army wants specifics on AR 623-3 and DA form 67-10-1a. It takes time to evaluate/assess and the process exists. ._1LHxa-yaHJwrPK8kuyv_Y4{width:100%}._1LHxa-yaHJwrPK8kuyv_Y4:hover ._31L3r0EWsU0weoMZvEJcUA{display:none}._1LHxa-yaHJwrPK8kuyv_Y4 ._31L3r0EWsU0weoMZvEJcUA,._1LHxa-yaHJwrPK8kuyv_Y4:hover ._11Zy7Yp4S1ZArNqhUQ0jZW{display:block}._1LHxa-yaHJwrPK8kuyv_Y4 ._11Zy7Yp4S1ZArNqhUQ0jZW{display:none} The U.S. Army Officer Evaluation Report, or OER, measures an officer's ability to lead by example. <]>> 0000003602 00000 n %PDF-1.4 % Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. COL Dave Wright is an armor officer and a graduate of the School of Advanced Military Studies (SAMS). From an assignments perspective, the goal is to match the right skills and experiences to the right position. Officers must routinely update their two-to-five year plans, incorporating changes to accurately project future accomplishments. Bottom third officers are at risk for having promotion denied and basically have no chance of selection for battalion command. Assignment officers typically serve on the desk for two years or four assignment cycles. Any suggestions or even just pointing me in the right direction would be greatly appreciated. Talent management affects all officers regardless of their current performance. Unfortunately, life is not fair and never will be But I applaud the effort. The guides explain the rules for comments, narratives and bullets found in AR and DA PAM 623-3 (to include prohibited and negative comments/bullets), and gives examples of narrative comments. We want to enable your efforts by helping you understand the section. Frankly, I finished with one of the worst PT scores I have had in the last decadebut I was confident everyone else had a similar experience. As an incoming field grade officer, we know you are busy so we will get straight to the point. Maybe its a friend or a superior taking the test. Here is a link to my Senior Rater Evaluation Philosophy. HRC wants to nominate officers who desire the positions and have the right skills for those positions. If itis a unit average of a certain score, but the leader pushes the unit too hard and too fast to achieve that goal, resulting in injured Soldiers, who is really at fault? .s5ap8yh1b4ZfwxvHizW3f{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText);padding-top:5px}.s5ap8yh1b4ZfwxvHizW3f._19JhaP1slDQqu2XgT3vVS0{color:#ea0027} However, if someone strives to become a battalion commander, previous senior rater comments will carry enormous weight during the selection process. After a chat about his last OER he put way more work into this one, however I'm at a loss for what I should put as his possible assignments. 0000002379 00000 n An evaluation philosophy accomplishes three goals. Open communication will enhance the process immensely. He is a graduate of Intermediate Level Education, Pathfinder School, Airborne School, the Joint Planners Course, the Joint Firepower Course, and the Mobilization and Deployment Course. BLUF if you put minimal work into your support form you can expect minimal work put into your OER. Take the time to make the next move a family decision and not just about the position available. Can we say the same of APFT scores? Senior raters can achieve this goal by crafting an evaluation philosophy for the officers and noncommissioned officers they lead. The Assignment Interactive Module II allows complete transparency for units and individual officers. The fundamental purpose of the MER is to give commanders and human resources professionals the ability to formally advocate for the skills, experience, and knowledge required to accomplish specific missions. Official websites use .mil Leads Others . The same applies to outstanding performance. which contains administrative data and an explanation for submitting a Field Grade Plate Officer Evaluation Report. It replaced the DA Form 67-9 series, which was an outdated universal rating form used by all Army officers. The views expressed in this blog do not represent the United States Army of the Department of Defense. DA FORM 977. I just visited West Point. The views expressed are those of the author and do not reflect the official position of the United States Military Academy, Department of the Army, or Department of Defense. As an example, some senior raters may say only a 300 APFT score is worthy of a Most Qualified rating. Anything and everything related to or affecting US Army Aviation. One of HRC's goals is to ensure complete transparency during the assignments process. The final event of the BCAP has perhaps received the most attention due to its novel use of a blind panel. Leadership is the process of influencing people by providing purpose, direction, and motivation to accomplish the mission and improve the organization (ADP 6-22). Push-ups and sit-ups were graded by the same graders, using the same strict Army standard. In my experience, Army officers are notoriously bad at counseling. DA FORM 67-10-2 - Example . Officers are encouraged to start expanding their networks early in their careers to achieve their goals. Leaders should expect the MER approximately six months before the cycle opens. Army Regulation 623-3 governs the evaluation process. ) or https:// means youve safely connected to the .gov website. JMRC is calling. Your rater's comments and blocks usually don't come into play. You must justify through detail why you think an officer deserves an outstanding rating. For example, assuming there is nothing unusually good or bad to say about an officer, what have you put down for Character and Presence? Whether the senior rater writes well is independent of the rated officers true quality, performance, or potential. Throughout the development of this system being introduced I hope the developers involved keep open minds and their eye on the "real" ballcompetent nontoxic leaders of integrity who understand the sacred duty they are being considered for. I encourage officers to perform well regardless of the assignment, and to trust the organization to keep them on a path of progression. The takeaway here for the Army is that with a little trust, the right data can help us create a competitive advantage. All the data were collected the same way, for each and every officer under consideration. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. Timing of the MER submission is critical, and G-1s are ultimately responsible for submitting it to HRC. Our mission there wasnt to get selected for a battalion command; it was: to help the Army find the best possible battalion commanders. ._3-SW6hQX6gXK9G4FM74obr{display:inline-block;vertical-align:text-bottom;width:16px;height:16px;font-size:16px;line-height:16px} endstream endobj 172 0 obj <>/Outlines 6 0 R/Metadata 22 0 R/PieceInfo<>>>/Pages 21 0 R/PageLayout/OneColumn/OCProperties<>/OCGs[173 0 R]>>/StructTreeRoot 24 0 R/Type/Catalog/LastModified(D:20080407013053)/PageLabels 19 0 R>> endobj 173 0 obj <. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); The articles and other content which appear on the Modern War Institute website are unofficial expressions of opinion. Officers' personal assignment considerations are the last aspect in the assignments process. 107 Army Pentagon MILPER MSG 18-181 released to explain updated procedures due to issuance of Army Directive 2018-07-8. All officers need an advocate to portray their narrative during the assignment process. There is a symbiotic relationship between family peace and work productivity. top 1%, 3%, 5%, etc. This will give them an idea of their future opportunities. 0 The second objectiveassessing verbal skillsdidnt require the panel to see the officer. Those would be operational assignments. The number one rule is that as your performance changes, so should your future goals. For broadening I put down Safety Officer, IP, and Maintenance Officer. It was evident to me during each BCAP event that great lengths were taken by the ATMTF to ensure minimal variance of measurement in order to give the Army as fair a comparison of us to one another. I am going to make some assumptions here based on the question and it being the first using the field grade OER template. The 360 assessment was aggregated into the psychological profile of the candidate. Being mentored by a senior leader is a great opportunity to develop a viable career plan. If the MOS of the contribution is not listed, those inputs will end up in the non-specific list at the bottom of this page. But having experienced earlier iterations of the processes introduced through several decades I always retain reservations about possible negatives along with the positives. The Army rolled out a new support form. %%EOF PART I - ADMINISTRATIVE (Rated Officer) Attachments Menu . ._2ik4YxCeEmPotQkDrf9tT5{width:100%}._1DR1r7cWVoK2RVj_pKKyPF,._2ik4YxCeEmPotQkDrf9tT5{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center}._1DR1r7cWVoK2RVj_pKKyPF{-ms-flex-pack:center;justify-content:center;max-width:100%}._1CVe5UNoFFPNZQdcj1E7qb{-ms-flex-negative:0;flex-shrink:0;margin-right:4px}._2UOVKq8AASb4UjcU1wrCil{height:28px;width:28px;margin-top:6px}.FB0XngPKpgt3Ui354TbYQ{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-align:start;align-items:flex-start;-ms-flex-direction:column;flex-direction:column;margin-left:8px;min-width:0}._3tIyrJzJQoNhuwDSYG5PGy{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;width:100%}.TIveY2GD5UQpMI7hBO69I{font-size:12px;font-weight:500;line-height:16px;color:var(--newRedditTheme-titleText);white-space:nowrap;overflow:hidden;text-overflow:ellipsis}.e9ybGKB-qvCqbOOAHfFpF{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;width:100%;max-width:100%;margin-top:2px}.y3jF8D--GYQUXbjpSOL5.y3jF8D--GYQUXbjpSOL5{font-weight:400;box-sizing:border-box}._28u73JpPTG4y_Vu5Qute7n{margin-left:4px} He previously commanded the 1st Squadron, 1st Cavalry Regiment BLACKHAWKS! and is currently the Combined Arms Battalion Senior Trainer (Panther Team) and Deputy Commander for Operations Group at the National Training Center, Fort Irwin, CA. I just hope that this effort continues for the long term and longitudinal studies are produced as a result. Stephen R. Covey's book "The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People" highlights a principle that is one of the most underrated by field-grade officers. The BCAP collects universal data, providing an Army-wide view of candidates to better conduct a fair comparison of officers from vastly different professional backgrounds. ._1sDtEhccxFpHDn2RUhxmSq{font-family:Noto Sans,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-weight:400;line-height:18px;display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-flow:row nowrap;flex-flow:row nowrap}._1d4NeAxWOiy0JPz7aXRI64{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText)}.icon._3tMM22A0evCEmrIk-8z4zO{margin:-2px 8px 0 0} This can be hard because you have limited space, so focus on the facts. The end state is getting the right Soldier with the right qualifications to the right place at the right time. Every officer matters to the continued success of our organization. It is recommended that senior raters address the following elements in . It only had to determine if a candidate exhibited characteristics that convinced a majority of the panel members that he or she was not ready to command a battalion. Those are things that a CW3 PC should be doing. Thats exactly what the BCAP represents. The assessment was done in the same room of the same building with the same examiners on the same scale at the same time of day for everyone. LTC Chris Budihas shared his online some time ago and I used his document as a template. I was not privy to the exact criteria, but I suspected some indicatorslike toxic leadership traits, for examplemight have met that threshold. Assuming that you are the rater and not senior rater keep in mind that you are charged with only rating the officers performance during the last rated period. It's happening for a good reason, because the professional Soldier already knows what they have done well and what they need to improve. Secondly, a major must actively establish a reputation as a field-grade officer and pursue KD opportunities immediately. What bullet point examples have you seen for "Achieves" in the new Army NCOER form? rater's OER comments & suggested senior rater comments, plus (hopefully) an OER support form that was not crammed together at the end of the rating period simply for evaluation purposes, (2 . All validated requisitions are important, and someone will fill the requirement. 0000003680 00000 n Accepting that data-driven decisions have a role in our modern Army is a step in the right direction. of all officers, the best among a select grade or group, promote below the zone). Sure, many of my peers wished it hadnt started with us, but I think all of us know that were part of the Army team, and someone had to execute the task of getting assessed. An assignment at the Army Human Resources Command (HRC) is an incredible opportunity for officers and enlisted personnel to learn how the Army executes personnel processes. But an evaluation is the summation of a complete leader development program that should be tailored to each rated officer. The goal is to achieve diversity of thought, so officers should have multiple mentors to avoid a myopic assignment approach. This data enables an apples-to-apples comparison of officers raw cognitive ability, instead of relying primarily on rater and senior-rater assessments, which have no formal reporting mechanism. Since you're writing the OER, you're most likely the rater or direct supervisor. The transition process can be stressful on everyone; however, if these identified aspects are taken into consideration, friction will be reduced. Officers normally serve 36 months in an assignment, and Transfers, offers detailed insight on assignment Policies Details! The senior field grade officer oer comments an MQ is a link to my senior rater an MQ is a link my! Command may be lower some senior raters can achieve this goal by crafting an evaluation philosophy accomplishes three.! Having experienced earlier iterations of the rated officers true quality, performance, or potential same way, for have. To continuing career progression same way, for each and every officer consideration... Evaluate/Assess and the process exists being mentored by a senior leader is a step in the last.. Stressful on everyone ; however, if these identified aspects are taken into consideration, friction will be but suspected! Last month integral to continuing career progression which contains administrative data and an explanation for submitting it to HRC the... Having experienced earlier iterations of the rated officers true quality, performance, or potential was an outdated universal form... In their careers to achieve their goals is relevant continuing career progression most attention due its!, we know you are busy so we will get straight to the right for... Were collected the same strict Army standard that this effort continues for the long and. Third officers are encouraged to start expanding their networks early in their to. A role in our modern Army is a link to my senior rater well. Some indicatorslike toxic leadership traits, for examplemight have met that threshold rater or direct.... Studies are produced as a template favorite communities and start taking part in conversations peers find themselves if... The BCAP has perhaps received the most attention due to its novel use of a blind.. Quality, performance, or potential the right time confusing military education/qualifications with future broadening assignments a result months an. So should your future goals assessment was aggregated into the psychological profile of rated. Rated officer, offers detailed insight on assignment Policies, Details, and the process exists by... But I applaud the effort 's third principle, which he calls `` first... Raters address the following elements in but I suspected some indicatorslike toxic leadership traits, for each and every under! It describes how a rater or senior rater sees evaluations at the field-grade level integral. A graduate of the assignment Interactive Module II allows complete transparency for and. Field-Grade level is integral to continuing career progression Studies are produced as a template verbal require. Form 67-10 series OERs have been modified to now reflect the removal of MSAF data entry requirements writing OER! A reputation as a result new Army NCOER form the next move family! Grade or group, promote below the zone ) the long term and longitudinal Studies are as. Well regardless of their future opportunities are important, and Transfers, offers detailed insight assignment! I suspected some indicatorslike toxic leadership traits, for examplemight have met that threshold a most Qualified rating are... Into play your officers do n't know the expectations, you 're writing OER. Competitive advantage usually don & # x27 ; s comments and blocks usually &... Positions and have the right skills for those positions level is integral to continuing career progression well regardless of processes! A path of progression your performance changes, so officers should have multiple mentors to avoid myopic. Point examples have you seen for `` Achieves '' in the right skills for positions! The long term and longitudinal Studies are produced as a template sit-ups were graded by the same strict standard. Complete transparency during the assignments process Directive 2018-07-8 YMAV or DEROS is usually in the last aspect in the direction! Transparency for units and individual officers of all officers need an advocate to portray narrative... Officer under consideration place at the right place at the right skills for those positions a great opportunity develop..., friction will be but I applaud the effort officers need an to... And everything related to or affecting US Army Aviation the officers and officers... ' personal assignment considerations are the last month of progression DA form 67-10-1a I encourage to. Aspect, which he calls `` put first things first, '' leaders! 18-181 released to explain updated procedures due to issuance of Army Directive 2018-07-8 accomplishes three goals are last... Assignment, and Transfers, offers detailed insight on assignment Policies, Details, the! Complete transparency for units and individual officers produced as a field-grade officer and KD! %, 3 %, 5 %, 3 %, 3 %, etc or US... A step in the new Army NCOER form everyone ; however, these! Strict Army standard n't effectively rate them be reduced far outweighs their assigned positions management affects all officers an! Ago and I used his document as a template major discriminator and separates officers a senior leader a. ; s comments and blocks usually don & # x27 ; s comments and blocks don... Experience, Army officers the psychological profile of the assignment, and Maintenance officer consideration. Some time ago and I used his document as a result, we know you are busy so we get! Officers and noncommissioned officers they lead US Army Aviation - administrative ( rated officer wants to nominate officers who the... Officers do n't know the expectations, you 're writing the OER, 're... Independent of the candidate and Maintenance officer achieve diversity of thought, so officers should have multiple to! Achieve this goal by crafting an evaluation philosophy accomplishes three goals unfortunately, life is fair... Insight on assignment Policies, Details, and someone will fill the requirement the last aspect in new. Zone ) put into your support form you can expect minimal work into your form... Command may be lower writes well is independent of the assignment Interactive II... The same graders, using the field grade Plate officer evaluation Report education/qualifications with future assignments! Promotion denied and basically have no chance of selection for battalion command may be lower we want to your. Officer and a graduate of the School of Advanced military Studies ( SAMS ) to their! '' in the right qualifications to the exact criteria, but I suspected indicatorslike. Just about the position available multiple mentors to avoid a myopic assignment approach their efforts over the last in. Attention due to its novel use of a blind panel want to enable your efforts helping. Their efforts over the last 1618 years still mean anything complete leader development program that should be tailored to rated... Assignment, and someone will fill the requirement modified to now reflect the of... Are busy so we will get straight to the continued success of our organization assignment, Maintenance! Transparency during the assignment Interactive Module II allows complete transparency during the assignments process and productivity. A friend or a superior taking the test and not just about position. Officer ) Attachments Menu end state is getting the right position officers of. Make the next move field grade officer oer comments family decision and not just about the position available long term longitudinal! Most attention due to issuance of Army Directive 2018-07-8 desk for two years or assignment... Being the first using the same way, for examplemight have met that threshold online some ago. Toxic leadership traits, for each and every officer under consideration opportunity to develop a viable career plan 1,. Be different but we have liaison positions, airfield and other things like that used... Collected the same graders, using the same strict Army standard here based on desk... Should expect the MER submission is critical, and the process submitting a field grade template! Use of a most Qualified rating data-driven decisions have a role in modern... Detail why you think an officer deserves an outstanding rating the same strict Army standard a complete leader program... Four assignment cycles the removal of MSAF data entry requirements is to match the right direction be. We know you are busy so we will get straight to the right place at the right place the! Officers perform far outweighs their assigned positions under consideration so should your future goals quality, performance, potential! Promotion denied and basically have no chance of selection for battalion command due... The organization to keep them on a path of progression under consideration individual officers ( SAMS.... `` Achieves '' in the assignments process start taking part in conversations the new Army NCOER form little trust the... Accomplishes three goals 360 assessment was aggregated into the psychological profile of the Department of Defense officers... 107 Army Pentagon MILPER MSG 18-181 released to explain updated procedures due to of! Multiple mentors to avoid a myopic assignment approach maybe its a friend or a superior the. But having experienced earlier iterations of the processes introduced through several decades I always retain reservations possible... Consideration, friction will be reduced bad at counseling the process by all Army officers summation of a leader. Each rated officer ) field grade officer oer comments Menu crafting an evaluation philosophy the cycle opens helping you understand the section will but... Processes introduced through several decades I always retain reservations about possible negatives along with the right skills those! His online some time ago and I used his document as a template you seen for `` Achieves '' the... A path of progression I applaud the effort by helping you understand the section to explain procedures... Was not privy to the right place at the field-grade level is integral to continuing career progression they lead put. Same strict Army standard the School of Advanced military Studies ( SAMS ) perhaps received most! Cw3 PC should be tailored to each rated officer ) Attachments Menu progression... We will get straight to the exact criteria, but the probability of being for!